Potential areas of Settlement

[Ironwall]

So I'm in the very early stages of putting a game of Runequest together the idea is the players will make a clan that recently was uprooted by something (the cause of the uprooting will also be decided) so i have a question as to possible locations in Dragon Pass where they could settle i have 3 current idea 

1. Conquer Jomesland from the lunars. (Ressurect the Maboder or even start a new tribe)

2. Settle the lands disputed by the Telmori, Cinsina Tribe, and Culbrea Tribe (With the clan joining one of the two tribes)

3.  Settle the Smoking Ruins (an idea i got from reading a thread here but I've forgotten who posted it and what it was called) which would probably cause some tension with the Grazers

are there any other places in dragon pass the clan could settle. Also would the dragonnewts be territorial if they settled somewhere in the dragonnewt wildlands. 

[Stephen L]

The Dragonnewt wilds are an excellent idea.  Lush, fertile, uninhabited, and the weird Dragonnewts ignoring human settlers. 

Except every so often the Dragonnewts inexplicably decide to eradicate the humans.  It's called Huntland.

The subject of the following thread:

https://basicroleplaying.org/topic/13011-two-questions-about-dragonewts/?do=findComment&comment=202121

 

[jajagappa]

15 minutes ago, Ironwall said:

possible locations in Dragon Pass where they could settle i have 3 current idea

Any of those work.  You could also choose the Renekot's Hope site (see Pegasus Plateau scenarios) and either have them expand the settlement there, or assume there isn't anyone there and it's a place where they can settle instead.

Another potential spot is Dwarf Run, but they have to come to an agreement with the Dwarf first (otherwise the eastern Bush Range is largely depopulated).  They might have to deal with irruptions of Chaos from Snakepipe Hollow, there are dinosaurs around, and it's one way the Lunar army can get to Dragon Pass, but it's relatively open.

18 minutes ago, Ironwall said:

Also would the dragonnewts be territorial if they settled somewhere in the dragonnewt wildlands.

Most sources suggest they ignore humans (i.e. the settlers at Tink), until they don't.  And then they hunt and eat them.  So, you just never know.

Other options:

The Woods of the Dead - have the issue of Brangbane and his ghouls, but if you could clear them out...

Possibly the Brambleberry Hills and Dog Rat Vale - think those were somewhat abandoned and overgrown.

[Ironwall]

4 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

Possibly the Brambleberry Hills and Dog Rat Vale - think those were somewhat abandoned and overgrown.

from what i understand these places are cursed but i dont know what the curse is 

[Leingod]

Another possibility would be the Brambleberry Hills, which lie between the Arfritha Vale and the Dog-Rat Valley. They were home to the Karandoli clan of the Colymar, who vanished mysteriously. The hills were then taken over by their rivals, the Jenstali (also of the Colymar), until they were mysteriously wiped out by a mysterious curse some years later. The hills are now "overgrown with weeds," i.e. uninhabited. King of Sartar ties this in with Argrath, who claimed to descend from the vanished Karandoli in the male line (though he and at least his father were actually raised among kin in the Orlmarth clan).

If you'll look on the maps provided in the GameMaster Screen Pack, you'll see that a clan that settled in the Brambleberries would be right in-between the Lysang and Namolding, the sundered "Tree Triaty" clans (inhabiting the Arfritha and the Dog-Rat, respectively), which means settling here would pretty much inevitably lead to both the Colymar and the Malani trying to lay claim to a new clan's loyalty. Which sounds like it's got plenty of story potential.

2 minutes ago, Ironwall said:

from what i understand these places are cursed but i dont know what the curse is 

The old Karandoli lands are believed cursed, at least, which is why no one lives there ever since the Jenstali died, but it might just that the Jenstali were cursed because they and the Karandoli were bitter enemies (King of Sartar also seems to claim that it was one of Argrath's ancestors who wiped them out, because in an attempt to expel the curse the Jenstali used the "Summons of Evil" and, well, lost).

[jajagappa]

59 minutes ago, Leingod said:

because in an attempt to expel the curse the Jenstali used the "Summons of Evil" and, well, lost

So, you can use this to define any "curse" you like for the area and why it hasn't been populated since.  Maybe there is a powerful demon, evil spirit, or hostile nymph that wanders the valley.  Maybe the curse affects crops so they wither and die and instead give rise to thorny brambles (or that's what the demon, spirit, or nymph do to attempts to farm the area).  Or anything else of your imagining.  Just figure it's probably not an easy curse to lift (maybe it's a curse within a curse so that you need to eradicate one, and then discover that was masking something as bad underneath).

[Leingod]

42 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

So, you can use this to define any "curse" you like for the area and why it hasn't been populated since.  Maybe there is a powerful demon, evil spirit, or hostile nymph that wanders the valley.  Maybe the curse affects crops so they wither and die and instead give rise to thorny brambles (or that's what the demon, spirit, or nymph do to attempts to farm the area).  Or anything else of your imagining.  Just figure it's probably not an easy curse to lift (maybe it's a curse within a curse so that you need to eradicate one, and then discover that was masking something as bad underneath).

Very possible. Or, if you don't want to make as big a deal of that (or just want to save it for later), it could be that only the Jenstali were cursed and the land itself is fine if you aren't one of them (or related to them, if you want a more selective problem). Or maybe if at least a few members of the new clan actually had some Karandoli descent, and that either keeps the curse from triggering (which can have its own storytelling potential if there are only a small number, or even if it actually hangs on this one very old woman who was born a Karandoli, or something like that) or gives them (especially if they're PCs) some options for dealing with it that wouldn't be available normally.

[Nevermet]

3 hours ago, Stephen L said:

The Dragonnewt wilds are an excellent idea.  Lush, fertile, uninhabited, and the weird Dragonnewts ignoring human settlers. 

Except every so often the Dragonnewts inexplicably decide to eradicate the humans.  It's called Huntland.

The subject of the following thread:

https://basicroleplaying.org/topic/13011-two-questions-about-dragonewts/?do=findComment&comment=202121

 

Pelorians trying to make sense of Newts would be fun.

....well.... OOC fun.  IC, it'd probably be terrifying

[Sir_Godspeed]

Someone else on this forum wanted to settle their clan somewhere, though their desire to be somewhere a bit out of the way, so as to give the new clan some time to develop their own unique clan customs. I believe someone, possibly @Joerg mentioned a number unsettled valley in the foothills of the Western Rockwoods? Possibly the Red Dragon Vale or something?

[Bill the barbarian]

3 hours ago, jajagappa said:

So, you can use this to define any "curse" you like for the area and why it hasn't been populated since.  Maybe there is a powerful demon, evil spirit, or hostile nymph that wanders the valley.  Maybe the curse affects crops so they wither and die and instead give rise to thorny brambles (or that's what the demon, spirit, or nymph do to attempts to farm the area).  Or anything else of your imagining.  Just figure it's probably not an easy curse to lift (maybe it's a curse within a curse so that you need to eradicate one, and then discover that was masking something as bad underneath).

Nice!

 

9 minutes ago, Sir_Godspeed said:

Someone else on this forum wanted to settle their clan somewhere, though their desire to be somewhere a bit out of the way, so as to give the new clan some time to develop their own unique clan customs. I believe someone, possibly @Joerg mentioned a number unsettled valley in the foothills of the Western Rockwoods? Possibly the Red Dragon Vale or something?

If it was not @Joerg, it well could have been. What say you my german friend?

[Ironwall]

5 hours ago, jajagappa said:

So, you can use this to define any "curse" you like for the area and why it hasn't been populated since.  Maybe there is a powerful demon, evil spirit, or hostile nymph that wanders the valley.  Maybe the curse affects crops so they wither and die and instead give rise to thorny brambles (or that's what the demon, spirit, or nymph do to attempts to farm the area).  Or anything else of your imagining.  Just figure it's probably not an easy curse to lift (maybe it's a curse within a curse so that you need to eradicate one, and then discover that was masking something as bad underneath).

speculation but there is apparently a Dragonnewt city above the snow line of the mountains adjacent to the Bramblewood and the two face hills to the south south have a dream dragon could possibly make that the source of the curse

[Ironwall]

so I've looked at all these suggestions you've made(thank you) and look over the map and looked at what caught my fancy and will make a list of with pros and cons of each. if you know of any material where any of these places are described please tell me it could help. also feel free to say something if your a late comer to this thread.

1. Dwarf Run 

Pros

• possible access to dwarven crafts 
• on the map lands appear to be hills and plains close to a river

Cons

• dealing with dwarfs
• close to snakepipe hollow
• on a possible lunar invasion router

2. Woods of the dead

Pros

• untapped forest lands
• close to a road 

Cons 

• full of undead and needs to be cleared
• technically owned by the Dinacolli need permission or to defeat them to stay
• would need to start from scratch

3. East Bush Range

Pros

• looks fertile 
• easy to claim low population

Cons

• Dragonnewts on one side Lunars on the other
• Would need to start from scratch 

4. Jomesland

Pros

• already under plow and maintained
• fertile hills and plains
• Maboder survivors might join

Cons 

• need to take by force from lunars
• right next to the Telmori
• could destabilize the area 

5. Disputed Lands

Pros

• good grazing and especially hunting grounds

Cons

• likely poor farming
• start from scratch
• land is claimed by the telmori, Culbrea, Jomesland, and Cinsina

6. Tamlane hills

Pros

• at the foot of Kero Fin Herself 
• likely great herding grounds
• easy to claim
• possibility to tame dinosaurs

Cons

• inhabited by bandits
• right next to a place with a lot of dinosaurs could cause some problems
• right next to the Upland marsh undead can be a problem
• a bit isolated from the rest of Sartar (although could be considered a Pro)

Smoking Ruins

Pros

• soil is likely highly fertile from all that ash
• ruins to inhabit and loot
• Holy to Orlanth and Ernalda (the place they wed i belive may be wrong)

Cons

• need to stop that smoking
• Grazelanders may be a problem

Brambleberry hils

Pros

• possibly good grazing
• Berries may be abundant and possibly a valuable asset
• Close to major population centers 

Cons

• Dragonnewts and a dream dragon
• Possible curse
• will need work

[Nevermet]

So which appeals most to you?

Edited March 23, 2021 by Nevermet

[Bill the barbarian]

Just a couple of thoughts to help out (I hope).

39 minutes ago, Ironwall said:

1. Dwarf Run 

 

Pros or Cons

Dealing with the Solar worshipping horse riding Alda-Churans.

41 minutes ago, Ironwall said:

2. Woods of the dead

 

I wonder if you would have to deal with the Dinacoli (the ranking power in this ‘hood) or with the Alone Undertribe, the neighbours. Do you have citations for the Dinacoli owning this area?

 

47 minutes ago, Ironwall said:

4. Jomesland

 

I do not believe there are Lunars here post Dragonrise, but there are Telmori, Torkani (who do have blains to the territory) and possibly returning Maboder.

 

[Lordabdul]

9 hours ago, Ironwall said:

are there any other places in dragon pass the clan could settle.

I'll add some other proposals that make your Glorantha vary a bit more:

1. The Dundealos have completely collapsed years ago and are not coming back (or at least not in numbers big enough to make a clan, let alone a tribe)... so after the Dragonrise, when the occupiers on their lands are in disarray, it's all up for grabs.
2. Pick a clan, any clan. Declare that they were a bit too cozy with the Lunars, and that after 1625 their neighbours attacked them and ran them out of their lands. Serves them right! Your refugees, on the other hand, have deals (old or recent) with someone in power (Kallyr, Leika, whoever) and get these lands as a gift... or have to work their way into them. The good thing is that it lets you pick almost any place you like in Dragon Pass.
3. Tweak the date of the Maboder massacre, ignore Jomes Wulf and have your refugees be the ones who push the Telmori back! They're desperate, and that gives Passion bonuses for combat!

Edited March 23, 2021 by lordabdul

[Nick Brooke]

9 hours ago, Leingod said:

Another possibility would be the Brambleberry Hills, which lie between the Arfritha Vale and the Dog-Rat Valley. They were home to the Karandoli clan of the Colymar, who vanished mysteriously. The hills were then taken over by their rivals, the Jenstali (also of the Colymar), until they were mysteriously wiped out by a mysterious curse some years later. The hills are now "overgrown with weeds," i.e. uninhabited. King of Sartar ties this in with Argrath, who claimed to descend from the vanished Karandoli in the male line (though he and at least his father were actually raised among kin in the Orlmarth clan).

Maybe your players can find a way to terminate the dread curse that wiped out the Jenstali clan, at which point an equal-and-opposite curse springs back to life and goes looking for a member of the Karandoli clan to attack.

That’ll make them popular.

[EricW]

How about Snake Pipe Hollow itself? You could have a lot of fun with that. 

Perhaps the Red Emperor wants to declare a special administration zone, similar to the deal the Lunars offered to Orlanthi who settle Riskland on the borders of Dorastor.

[Stephen L]

5 hours ago, Ironwall said:

so I've looked at all these suggestions you've made

This was also covered a bit in the thread about Sartar population densities:

https://basicroleplaying.org/topic/13662-population-density-dragon-pass-holy-country/

However, I'm not sure there were many more suggestions for anywhere else not covered in you list

5 hours ago, Ironwall said:

possibility to tame dinosaurs

The duck of the party in my campaign now has a Hadrosaur steed....

[Joerg]

I think that anywhere unsettled in the region is unsettled for a reason. Not that that reason may still be pertinent, but something will have kept people from moving there and founding new steads.

Usually the reason would be neighbors, and in case of the foothills of the Western Rockwoods or the eastern slopes of the northern Sky Reach range, those neighbors may include the trolls of Halikiv who have a history of staging huge and devastating raids into the lands north of the mountains.

Other neighbors in the region you might be wary of include the Red Dragon, the Hydra, and Sir Ethilrist. Dryad Woods sounds like you should be careful in clearing land, too.

There are people inhabiting Ormsgone Valley, and I think that they owe some tribute to the King of Aggar. But then, you will have to pay some form of tribute everywhere, unless you have a huge army at your beck, like e.g. the Black Horse Troop.

 

To me (just like John Wick in Pegasus Plateau) the Bush Range sounds like the most promising area to be re-settled. Moirades pursued a scorched earth strategy against the Exiles and made sure that the farmlands just outside of the Glowline would not offer a haven for rebellious Tarshites disputing the Lunar lineage's claims to that crown. Forty years of lying fallow may have led to reclamation by the wilderness, but will also have given the soil some rest.

Nasty neighbors - well, this is Glorantha. Tusk Riders go everywhere, Lunar Tarsh (and another stretch of no man's land) lies right beyond the Dragonspine, and dragonewts and dwarf mine are nearby, too. Snake Pipe Hollow isn't that far away. Then there are dinosaurs. The Tarsh Exiles have a grudge, and may think they have a claim on this land, too. On the other hand, you might be able to recruit some folk in the Alone region whose families came from here, giving you some ancestral claims. (Just don't believe Griselda's kin...)

Other than the Falling Ruin right on top of the Dragonspine, there don't appear to be any famous ruins nearby.

West of the Dragonspine you would be at the mercy of whatever happens in Tarsh and the Empire. If you are neutral or friendly to the Lunar Way, and willing to submit to the Empire or the Lunar royals whenever they come, those fringes might be a place to consider.

 

[Bill the barbarian]

5 hours ago, Joerg said:

I think that anywhere unsettled in the region is unsettled for a reason. Not that that reason may still be pertinent, but something will have kept people from moving there and founding new steads.

 

Yeah but it’s fantasy roleplaying, not science mon ami. the arguments just have to hold water and one is allowed to squint when deciding if it does.

 

5 hours ago, Joerg said:

To me (just like John Wick in Pegasus Plateau) the Bush Range sounds like the most promising area to be re-settled. Moirades pursued a scorched earth strategy against the Exiles and made sure that the farmlands just outside of the Glowline would not offer a haven for rebellious Tarshites disputing the Lunar lineage's claims to that crown. Forty years of lying fallow may have led to reclamation by the wilderness, but will also have given the soil some rest.

 

Sounds good, if it fits the table (the most important consideration after all).

5 hours ago, Joerg said:

Nasty neighbors - well, this is Glorantha. Tusk Riders go everywhere, Lunar Tarsh (and another stretch of no man's land) lies right beyond the Dragonspine, and dragonewts and dwarf mine are nearby, too. Snake Pipe Hollow isn't that far away. Then there are dinosaurs. The Tarsh Exiles have a grudge, and may think they have a claim on this land, too. On the other hand, you might be able to recruit some folk in the Alone region whose families came from here, giving you some ancestral claims. (Just don't believe Griselda's kin...)

 

Yep, trouble seems to be a recurrent theme in DP. Don’t sweat the petty things and by all the gods and goddesses... don’t pet the sweaty things!

[Ironwall]

13 hours ago, Bill the barbarian said:

I wonder if you would have to deal with the Dinacoli (the ranking power in this ‘hood) or with the Alone Undertribe, the neighbours. Do you have citations for the Dinacoli owning this area?

glorantha fan wiki not sure if its a good source but its a source if its not than its neighboring and not to much of a stretch for them to Claim its theirs escpecailly after its been cleared

 

[Ironwall]

14 hours ago, Nevermet said:

So which appeals most to you?

personally id choose eithir Brambleberry hills, Tamlane hills or the east bush range, but id probelly allow the player to hose from amongst the list

 

Edited March 23, 2021 by Ironwall

[Ali the Helering]

Good boar-hunting land in the Stinking Forest....🤪

[Nevermet]

1 hour ago, Ironwall said:

personally id choose eithir Brambleberry hills, Tamlane hills or the east bush range, but id probelly allow the player to hose from amongst the list

 

Makes sense 

[Joerg]

3 hours ago, Ironwall said:

glorantha fan wiki not sure if its a good source but its a source if its not than its neighboring and not to much of a stretch for them to Claim its theirs escpecailly after its been cleared

 

Of course. Brangbane was one of theirs.