1652 Great Flood

[metcalph]

Laskal gets flooded in '52?  Harrek's going to be pissed.

[jajagappa]

On ‎7‎/‎26‎/‎2018 at 4:46 AM, Joerg said:

The amount of soil moved in these projects would have yielded a dyke maybe 100 ft at the crown.

Who's talking about moving soil?  I'm suggesting raising the titanic earth spirits/elementals/giants from deep within the earth cube, or growing a mountain range, or using the thoughts of the Green Dragon to reshape the land.

[jajagappa]

17 hours ago, David Scott said:

here it is

The dwarves have been very busy.  They've repaired their entire cube in SW Glorantha  (see GtG p.691)!

[David Scott]

43 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

The dwarves have been very busy.  They've repaired their entire cube in SW Glorantha  (see GtG p.691)!

Yes, this is what they pull up with the capstan, see GtG pages 88, 89, 90, 502.

[David Scott]

53 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

Who's talking about moving soil?  I'm suggesting raising the titanic earth spirits/elementals/giants from deep within the earth cube, or growing a mountain range, or using the thoughts of the Green Dragon to reshape the land.

You may need to be more epic 🙂

[David Scott]

14 hours ago, metcalph said:

Laskal gets flooded in '52?  Harrek's going to be pissed.

My follow on question is - does he care?

[Joerg]

56 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

Who's talking about moving soil?  I'm suggesting raising the titanic earth spirits/elementals/giants from deep within the earth cube, or growing a mountain range, or using the thoughts of the Green Dragon to reshape the land.

In that case, why bother with dykes if you can just lift the entire land above the waves, like Belintar did with Loon Island.

Although I think that extending the Wonder Transfer (Guide p.254) effect would be a lot more cost efficient. 

Or quest for Kylerela and evacuate your population there.

Edited July 27, 2018 by Joerg

[jajagappa]

3 hours ago, David Scott said:

You may need to be more epic 🙂

Let's see: we could resurrect Genert; or maybe quest for the Seed of Genert to give birth to a new Earth child to hold back the waters; or maybe awaken Veskarthan/Lodril to lift the earth up on his shoulders.  I'm sure we can find more! 😉

[scott-martin]

58 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

Seed of Genert

Eyeballing the eastern edge of the flood map reveals that every ancient exotic seed stockpiled in the Paps (grandmothers are crafty) is going to get a chance to germinate after all, whether that process takes it through a triolini digestive tract or otherwise. Good to refresh the serpents as long as the people stay out of box canyons -- otherwise new forests may echo with laughter but not the ancestral "wa ha!"

[JonL]

2 hours ago, jajagappa said:

Let's see: we could resurrect Genert; or maybe quest for the Seed of Genert to give birth to a new Earth child to hold back the waters; or maybe awaken Veskarthan/Lodril to lift the earth up on his shoulders.  I'm sure we can find more! 😉

Vulcanism would be one way to get land up above the water line.

(I originally  mist-typed "Vulcanism" as "Vulvanism" - which which I'm less familiar, but sounds like it might be a way Ketha or Esrolla might rouse Veskarthen to action.) 

[jajagappa]

2 hours ago, JonL said:

(I originally  mist-typed "Vulcanism" as "Vulvanism" - which which I'm less familiar, but sounds like it might be a way Ketha or Esrolla might rouse Veskarthen to action.) 

Veskarthan is VERY sluggish.  Arousal is clearly a requirement of any quest to get his help.

[Joerg]

12 hours ago, jajagappa said:

Veskarthan is VERY sluggish.  Arousal is clearly a requirement of any quest to get his help.

The water might be cold, too...

[Joerg]

On a more serious note, something like the Syndic's Ban might be tried.

While Snodal was troubled about the threat of the White Bear Empire, his motivation to go and kill the God of the Silver Feet was a map of Fronela made by or attributed to Zzabur showing the future Fronela under the flood. Dormal's journey may very well have Thawed the Ban too soon.

If you look at the future catastrophes in King of Sartar, like Illiteracy, these could be side effects of someone (the Harshax?) in the south fragmenting reality like that.

[soltakss]

On 7/24/2018 at 11:22 AM, David Scott said:

I was reminded that I hadn't done the third map! So here is the final flood level with a special note. You'll see i've marked a red circle on the map. This place is important as its the separation pain of the Oslir river watershed and the Creek-stream-river watershed. I've chosen not to have the flood spill over at this point. If you want an Oslir catastrophe as part of this event - go ahead, but it doesnt seem to fit here unless you think otherwise.

Thanks for this. It was about a  month too late for our campaign, as the PCs stopped the iceberg from blocking Magasta's pool and moved it to the Creater instead. Harrek wanted to sail up the Oslir, for various in-game MGDV reasons, so the Flood would have reached the Oslir watershed. In the end, the River Voices were so appalled at the idea that they decided to do something very magical to stop it and ended the campaign.

[soltakss]

On 7/25/2018 at 7:17 PM, Joerg said:

Especially with Nochet and its Great Library I can see desperate and heroic action drama. Argan Argar's Safe spell might play a role here.

As would Asrelia's Cavern. 

I can see a lot of cults working desperately to stop the Flood (The Thunder Brothers stopping Worcha, for example) and many cults mitigating the effects of the Flood. Burying things in the ground, hiding them in magical protection areas, covering buildings with an upturned boat, all could be used to prevent the floodwaters from affecting a certain spot.

The Tricksters have a capital city that is effectively a huge dome that stops the waters getting in, perhaps all you need to do is ask Eurmal cultists to protect your town, what could possibly go wrong?

[soltakss]

On 7/26/2018 at 3:46 PM, scott-martin said:

Please you guys reassure me that truestone is really dense and that thing isn't going to float away from its sacred world-preserving duty like a big fizzing lode of lithium.

Oh, why couldn't you have posted this a couple of months ago?

I could have had so much fun with the Block floating away and a gigantic gnarled hand breaking the surface of the waters.

[soltakss]

On 7/27/2018 at 11:43 AM, jajagappa said:

Who's talking about moving soil?  I'm suggesting raising the titanic earth spirits/elementals/giants from deep within the earth cube, or growing a mountain range, or using the thoughts of the Green Dragon to reshape the land.

Aurelion made Aurelion's Breakwater in Pamaltela in such a fashion. Time for the Volcano Twins to shine.

[Joerg]

32 minutes ago, soltakss said:

Aurelion made Aurelion's Breakwater in Pamaltela in such a fashion. Time for the Volcano Twins to shine.

I assume you mean Jrustela here?

 

[soltakss]

7 hours ago, Joerg said:

I assume you mean Jrustela here?

 

Somewhere down south, yes.

I seem to remember that Ldril did something in Pamaltela, Caladra in Genertela, so it makes sense that Aurelion did in somewhere in between, so Jrustela. I was working from a faded memory, anyway.

The point stands that Aurelion has history of casting up great swathes of land to block a flood. In the Hero Wars, Aurelion cultists could band together and perform a HeroQuest to do exactly that.

[Darius West]

The problem is a huge iceberg blocking Magasta's whirlpool so...Time for a Tanian Fireberg to unblock the sink.  Follow this link to find the sorcerous explanation for Tanian. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghQWICNY0aY

 

[JonL]

The Iron Pillar ritual the Luatha used to shatter Seshnela might be effective in breaking up the mega-berg. Discussing anything with the Luatha is of course a fraught proposition,  but I don't expect they want to their island's coasts and shores to be inundated either. 

For that matter, opening the gates of Dawn or Dusk as spillways might be a means of stemming the tide. I don't know how big they are relative to the opening beneath Magasta's Pool, but some drainage is better than none. Of course, you've then got doorways to the Underworld sitting wide open for an indefinite period, which may entail further complications.

[jajagappa]

6 hours ago, JonL said:

The Iron Pillar ritual the Luatha used to shatter Seshnela might be effective in breaking up the mega-berg. Discussing anything with the Luatha is of course a fraught proposition,  but I don't expect they want to their island's coasts and shores to be inundated either. 

Probably depends on whether the dwarves got their blessing or not.  I don't suspect the Luatha will overly care about some of Orlanth's offspring being drowned.  And I'm sure they have their own sorcerers who can just raise the walls of the Tower of Dusk or raise some further bulwark farther out against it.

[Darius West]

Actually, there is a big and rather stupid problem with the Troll plan.  Annilla, the Blue Moon is going to smash right through it and shatter their iceberg (if it ever arrives).  The possible resultant tsunami may be a problem, but Magasta's Whirlpool will not stay blocked for long.  Just have some "Calm Waters" spells ready for the occasion.  Then there is the whole issue of the iceberg melting or breaking apart as it hits warm southern currents, well before it ever arrives at Magasta's Whirlpool, leaving a large number of malicious trolls to drown.  Yes, this plan could be scuttled by enough luke warm water.  Do you think the trolls will do  the maths to calculate the rate of melting on the way to the Whirlpool?  I doubt it. There is also the issue that the iceberg will have to pass by Brithos, and Zzabur could shatter the thing with a wink, and is likely to do so, as he wouldn't want Annilla occupying the position of the Spike.  Then there are the Mostali, and I doubt that they want a troll deity interfering with their plans to do with the Spike.  The answer is simple too, the Mostali simply get in their enormous concrete ships and shell the iceberg off Glorantha and into Tamriel in time for Elder Scrolls 4.  I also doubt the water tribes are going to be enamored of the plan, given that any gains they may make on the land will be temporary at best, and it stands to cripple their main god Magasta, and more importantly, it will kill the Styx and their other underworld deities.

Then there is the issue that the force of Magasta's Whirlpool is likely to completely destroy the iceberg through shear forces before it ever blocks the pool.  Ice isn't that strong, and I doubt the trolls know about Pycrete (and pycrete probably wouldn't be strong enough anyhow given the size of the whirlpool).

While I find the notion that the Blue Moon's velocity (built up over centuries, such that Annilla is often described as a "blue flash")  might not be enough to smash through the iceberg pretty laughable, it is remotely possible that Annilla will simply bounce off it, leaving a crater, failing in her duty.  That prospect alone should have the Blue Moon troll assassins working hard to veto this plan with the most extreme prejudice they can muster (and that is a lot of extreme prejudice). But there is the possibility that the Blue Moon are massively in on this whole plan, and they think that when the iceberg is in place, Annilla, despite her velocity , will simply hover over the iceberg, in exactly the way that bricks don't.  I wonder if the Trolls think that the imbalance of water on the top of the world will cause Glorantha to flip, and the skydome to fill with with water, drowning all the fire deities and leaving the world in darkness?  Yeah, that sounds dumb enough.  The only problem is that Annilla will also begin her course in reverse, pop the iceberg out from the other side, and the world will flip back again, and all life on Glorantha will die in the process as they are launched into solid objects at ridiculous rates of acceleration. The trolls on their high ground will not be immune. to that either.  Total annihilation of all the races, with the possible exception of Brithos which is off the map.  Hmm... maybe this is all part of Zzabur's long term plan?  It is still a dumb plan though, as it is ridiculously implausible to carry out.

In essence this is Trolls trying to think like Dwarves, and the outcome, like Trolls, is none too bright. Was the trollkin who came up with this called "Butters", and was he perchance wearing a tinfoil head-dress with a red gem on it at the time?

Edited November 28, 2018 by Darius West

[Sir_Godspeed]

Woah, you learn something new about Glorantha everyday. I'm surprised I don't remember this from KoS, it sounds like the (post-?)Hero Wars kind of thing that would've been put in there.

EDIT: But wouldn't the re-raising of Somelz also produce a lot of flood? Or would Magasta's pool be able to handle the overflow since it was still unplugged back then?

And what about the Umathelans and the Umathelan Aldryami, any notes on how they reacted to the mostali raising a new continent from under their feet?

So many questions, pardon me.

Edited November 28, 2018 by Sir_Godspeed

[PhilHibbs]

14 hours ago, Darius West said:

Actually, there is a big and rather stupid problem with the Troll plan.  Annilla, the Blue Moon is going to smash right through it and shatter their iceberg (if it ever arrives).

It might just punch a hole in it, not sure how big the Blue Moon is. Or it might just go straight through it without interacting, like a gigantic neutrino.