Atgxtg Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 45 minutes ago, Addison said: So the new version is going to be PBtA then? You're joking, right? Quote Chaos stalks my world, but she's a big girl and can take of herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Hooded Claw Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 Yes. I forgot the satire emoji. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atgxtg Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 5 minutes ago, Addison said: Yes. I forgot the satire emoji. Whew! If your not careful someone will be posting that as fact over on some other website. I just want to stress that right now, all we really know about KAP 6 is: Greg had been working on it for years Had a say as to what the changes were What Jeff said about putting more information into the core rulebook to make the game more accessible to new GMs. Everything else is conjecture. Quote Chaos stalks my world, but she's a big girl and can take of herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrippyHippy Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 (edited) So we can look forward to a new game that has a different title, scraps DEX because knights wear armour? You want to shout about rules? Yes, it’s a turnoff. If you wish to cite comments that Greg wanted a new edition, then fair enough. Otherwise, I’m out of this. I’ve seen how RuneQuest and Call of Cthulhu have been changed - not for the better. Edited March 2, 2020 by TrippyHippy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atgxtg Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, TrippyHippy said: So we can look forward to a new game that has a different title, scraps DEX because knights wear armour? You want to shout about rules? Yes, it’s a turnoff. Will you stop fuming for a minute and actually read the posts. I never said that the game scarps DEX, I said that DEX is one of the areas where the game could be improved. Right now it's practically a dump stat. I don't know where you are getting a different title. Quote If you wish to cite comments that Greg wanted a new edition, then fair enough. Greg spoke up about this back when Pendragon was starting to shift back to Chaosium. I'll see if I can dig it up. It also detailed three of four supplements for Pendragon that were in the works. Unfortunately the old nocturnal forums are difficult to search since they got spammed by porn right when the game was shifted back to Chaosium and were not maintained. I'll search. One thing I do know is the the guy in charge of the game now is someone who Greg put in charge back when the game was still published by Nocturnal, and not something assigned to the job by Chaosium. The folks at Chasoium wisely chose to keep Greg's handpicked successor. Check out his (David Larkin's)'posts on this thread:https://basicroleplaying.org/topic/8699-greg-staffords-king-arthur-pendragon-rpg-returns-to-chaosium-ownership/ Quote Otherwise, I’m out of this. I’ve seen how RuneQuest and Call of Cthulhu have been changed - not for the better. Oh, I'm with you there.I was disappointed with RQG. If Pendragon gets any sort of radical change I'll grab a torch and pitchfork and join you in stormin' the castle! But from what I've read/heard so far, this is all just following through on Greg's desire to update the published version of the game to the rules he was using at the time. Edited March 2, 2020 by Atgxtg Quote Chaos stalks my world, but she's a big girl and can take of herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mugen Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 (edited) Given that Chaosium built RQG on games dating from the first half of the 80s (Pendragon being the most recent game in the lot), I doubt they are in the mood for making a new edition of Pendragon that diverges from previous editions, and based on recent RPG design. I just hope they won't do the same as they did for skill opposition in RQG and just compare success levels... I think the game could benefit from removing the split between characteristics and skills, except perhaps for SIZ and/or CON. I would also change the system to make it more like HeroQuest, with success levels bumps instead of the current crit rules. Edited March 3, 2020 by Mugen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 On 3/2/2020 at 2:36 AM, IlluminatedSeraph said: As long as the rules changes stay at the level of cleaning/tidying/minor improvements, I don't think there's any disrespect. The current team has been doing much of that work with Greg's oversight for some time, so them continuing in the same vein seems only appropriate. And, frankly, I want more expansions and a live game, so I want the rules to continue evolving - preserving as much of Greg's work as possible, but not letting the game die because he's gone. We have no intention on letting Pendragon die, and want it a live game. Pendragon is one of my two favourite game systems of all time, and Greg's masterpiece of game design. We think a fully supported, fresh relaunch will give it the best opportunity for it to enjoy the success it dearly deserves. 8 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atgxtg Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 1 hour ago, Jeff said: We have no intention on letting Pendragon die, and want it a live game. Pendragon is one of my two favourite game systems of all time, and Greg's masterpiece of game design. We think a fully supported, fresh relaunch will give it the best opportunity for it to enjoy the success it dearly deserves. Good! Best wishes. Quote Chaos stalks my world, but she's a big girl and can take of herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7Tigers Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Curious people about 6th Pendragon Edition should listen from 31rst minutes of yesterday Lore of Glorantha with Sandy Petersen and Jeff Richard video: 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creativehum Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, 7Tigers said: Curious people about 6th Pendragon Edition should listen from 31rst minutes of yesterday Lore of Glorantha with Sandy Petersen and Jeff Richard video: I love that even after all these decades Greg was still trying to get the Battle System right. (I emailed back and forth with him about the 3rd. edition Battle System when it came out. He wasn't satisfied it's it as soon as it was published. It's been a long journey!) The idea of having four separate timeframe/setting books does make a heck of a lot sense, really. Different people are going to have different ideas of what Arthur "means" to them... and the ability to pick and choose what to focus on seems like it might be a winner. Edited March 4, 2020 by creativehum 1 Quote "But Pendragon isn’t intended to be historical, just fun. So have fun." -- Greg Stafford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atgxtg Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 7Tigers, thanks for the video. Although after watching it , I'm starting to get worried. The Battle System in the rules was never about who won the battle (players couldn't even affect the outcome of the battle normally, as the battles were scripted) and that only came around in the Book of Battles. So Jeff's statement there doesn't make sense. And dividing the GPC into four books in almost certainly going to end up costing GMs more than the GPC. 1 Quote Chaos stalks my world, but she's a big girl and can take of herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creativehum Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 1 hour ago, Atgxtg said: The Battle System in the rules was never about who won the battle (players couldn't even affect the outcome of the battle normally, as the battles were scripted) and that only came around in the Book of Battles. So Jeff's statement there doesn't make sense. I think you need to listen to the video once more. Jeff is agreeing with your point. He is saying Greg finally accept that the focus needs to be on what the PCs do, and the system should lean into that. It is about Greg (apparently) finally accepting this and building up the PC material. 1 hour ago, Atgxtg said: And dividing the GPC into four books in almost certainly going to end up costing GMs more than the GPC. From what I've read on this board (and, in fact, on this thread) people want more (a lot more) material for the campaign in the later phases of the game. The only way to do all that and put it in one book is to make that single book prohibitively expensive. Diving it up allows each of the phases to be as rich in material as anyone could dream of, with GMs either focusing on one or two books (as a lot of people will, since most people don't need or want to play through 80 years of gaming), or pick up all four books, spread out over a two year period of purchases. It seems like a feasible model given the peculiar nature of the Great Pendragon Campaign. Quote "But Pendragon isn’t intended to be historical, just fun. So have fun." -- Greg Stafford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyblade Posted March 4, 2020 Author Share Posted March 4, 2020 I think everything sounds very promising & exciting so far, rules cleanup and GPC expansion into 4 distinct era books is a win for me 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mandrill_one Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 If I remember correctly, dividing the GPC and/or the KAP rulebook up into 4 different era books was another one of those projects Greg had been working on for years. I was part of his "household knights" group for contributing to projects, and I've seen files on these changes at least since 2015. This didn't stop him from producing the 5.2 edition! Personally, given the situation and the passing away of Greg, I think that KAP couldn't be in better hands. The people at Chaosium (and David Larkins in particular) have the utmost respect for Greg's work and gaming legacy, and are also very good at making games (personal opinion again!). 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atgxtg Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 8 hours ago, creativehum said: I think you need to listen to the video once more. Jeff is agreeing with your point. He is saying Greg finally accept that the focus needs to be on what the PCs do, and the system should lean into that. It is about Greg (apparently) finally accepting this and building up the PC material. I did listen. Quote: "...for the longest time could not think of a battle system that wasn't about who wins the battle". The battle system in KAP 1-5.2 were all though up by Greg and were not about who wins the battle. So Greg could think of and did think of such a system. 8 hours ago, creativehum said: From what I've read on this board (and, in fact, on this thread) people want more (a lot more) material for the campaign in the later phases of the game. The only way to do all that and put it in one book is to make that single book prohibitively expensive. That's assuming they are indeed adding more content to each sub-book and not just breaking up what already exists. 8 hours ago, creativehum said: Diving it up allows each of the phases to be as rich in material as anyone could dream of, with GMs either focusing on one or two books (as a lot of people will, since most people don't need or want to play through 80 years of gaming), or pick up all four books, spread out over a two year period of purchases. It seems like a feasible model given the peculiar nature of the Great Pendragon Campaign. Each phase could always been as rich in material as anyone dream. The GPC was just an outline, and that's all it should ever be. That leave it pone for the inclusion of adventures and other material. I liked the idea from the first video on covering the various eras in the core rulebook. No I don't expect a huge section for each period, but a half page or a page or so on each should be included in the core book. Subdividing the game into 15-20 year subsections for people who don't want to play though the whole campaign means optimizing the game around four or five month campaigns for groups that play weekly.. So either they restart the campaign over, buy the new book, or switch to a different game. I'm still waiting to see what comes out, but I've got my fingers crossed. Quote Chaos stalks my world, but she's a big girl and can take of herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaxBasilisk Posted March 14, 2020 Share Posted March 14, 2020 For whatever it's worth... what I'd like to see: * Rules for childbirth and survival incorporated into main rulebook * Likewise with the marriage rules from Entourage * A Siege skill that isn't just an add-on * Consolidated Glory awards and quality (pages 122 and 257 vary in weird ways) * An early Saxon army that doesn't have mounted troops * All the tables having numeric designations, instead of just some * Table 5-3: Attributes Lost should be repeated in the combat chapter, for ease of reference. * "Your Own Land" extended with five pages of wacky stuff that happens at court * Table 5-3: Attributes Lost should be the cover art, for ease of reference * Cornish ninja PKs with throwing pasties 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyblade Posted March 16, 2020 Author Share Posted March 16, 2020 On 3/14/2020 at 4:46 AM, SaxBasilisk said: * Cornish ninja PKs with throwing pasties Oh f yes totally! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7dot62mm Posted March 16, 2020 Share Posted March 16, 2020 Other stuff I'd like to see: * Honor awards/penalties listed and explained (what if your squire dies from combat, or sickness, or suicide, do you lose honor etc.) * Clear explanation of when you may/may not use a passion for inspiration (Honor, Loyalty Lord etc.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffjerwin Posted March 17, 2020 Share Posted March 17, 2020 17 hours ago, Greyblade said: Oh f yes totally! As a Cornish person I must disagree. Our martial arts involve wrestling giants and ambushes out of hidden fogous. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atgxtg Posted March 18, 2020 Share Posted March 18, 2020 On 3/16/2020 at 11:19 PM, jeffjerwin said: Our martial arts involve wrestling giants All those cable sports channels and somehow I missed that. Quote Chaos stalks my world, but she's a big girl and can take of herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagonet Posted March 18, 2020 Share Posted March 18, 2020 (edited) On 3/17/2020 at 12:19 AM, jeffjerwin said: As a Cornish person I must disagree. Our martial arts involve wrestling giants and ambushes out of hidden fogous. How do your Cornish fighting arts stack up against LLAP-Goch? Edited March 19, 2020 by Dagonet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffjerwin Posted March 18, 2020 Share Posted March 18, 2020 26 minutes ago, Dagonet said: How do your Cornish fighting arts stack up against Llap Goch? AS a Cornish AND Welshman I am a master of all the fighting arts. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morien Posted March 18, 2020 Share Posted March 18, 2020 1 hour ago, jeffjerwin said: AS a Cornish AND Welshman I am a master of all the fighting arts. Even the fabled Ecky-Thump? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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