Designing the new RQ - Part 8: Jumping into the setting with Family Background

[MOB]

Jeff's latest design notes here discuss the new Family Background mechanics: 

http://www.chaosium.com/blog/designing-the-new-runequest-part-8/

[RosenMcStern]

This sounds like an extremely effective way of generating a character's personality and - at the same time - tying it to the background.

[aknaton]

This we like

[smiorgan]

**JOKE MODE ON**

 Can your maternal grandfather die in chargen before your mother was conceived?

**JOKE MODE OFF**

Impressive tool for a Pendragonesque Dragon Pass campaign. Very immersive.

I'd like also to have an alternative option for quick chargen to accommodate different play styles and the possibility of zero-to-hero for those who like it. Sometimes one just wants to fight baboons off Gringle's pawnshop and start worrying about ancestors, picking up passions, later in the campaign.

Just my two cents.

 

Edited June 12, 2016 by smiorgan

[Harshax]

Interesting approach. I loved King of Dragon Pass.  I suspect adding choices and options to family backgrounds will be an area rife for infinite fiddling for house-campaigns looking to add depth to local characters or include truly alien characters (non-Dragon Pass characters) in their game.

@smiorgan I think if you just don't do the pregen piece, you'll have a the result you're looking for. I can also see great fun in running with no family background and fill in each step of the pregen after a couple adventures. Players get exposed to the campaign world as it exists right now. Get to experience their character organically, then grow into the past that shapes their current view of the world.

[MOB]

10 minutes ago, smiorgan said:

I'd like also to have an alternative option for quick chargen to accommodate different play styles and the possibility of zero-to-hero for those who like it. Sometimes one just wants to fight baboons off Gringle's pawnshop and start worrying about ancestors, picking up passions, later in the campaign.

Just my two cents.

Easy. Just go straight past the family background step in character gen. And if you want a real unformed newbie, don't apply any add-ons from the occupation tables either. 

[smiorgan]

18 minutes ago, MOB said:

Easy. Just go straight past the family background step in character gen. And if you want a real unformed newbie, don't apply any add-ons from the occupation tables either. 

If it is modular like that, I'm sold. In fact, modularity is one of the great strengths of RQ/BRP games.  

Edited June 12, 2016 by smiorgan

[Belgath]

I like this a lot one of the big problems I had with Gloranthen based games is getting the players involved in the world. It tends to overwhelm them. This look like this will be a big help.

[pachristian]

Let me get this straight: I am trying to teach a new player to play RQ.

The first thing they are asked to do is to make up two stories of life and adventure that they then do not get to play? I'm going to ask a player to spend an hour writing background for their character, in an unfamiliar world and an unfamiliar mythology before they can even start making their character? That's a lot of work and investment to ask a player to start with.

I don't think I can sell that to a new player. 

I need them to be able to jump in, play, and THEN start learning the world and the mythology.

Sorry, this just doesn't sound very new-player-friendly. They need to start in media res - in other words, do stuff first, fill in backstory later.

[Jeff]

It is similar to the process of making a clan in King of Dragon Pass (and takes about as long as that does if you do it by reading it out loud). It is a quick crash course into the setting and takes about as long to explain as most people's explanation of the setting to new players.

Jeff

[rust]

14 minutes ago, pachristian said:

The first thing they are asked to do is to make up two stories of life and adventure that they then do not get to play? I'm going to ask a player to spend an hour writing background for their character, in an unfamiliar world and an unfamiliar mythology before they can even start making their character? That's a lot of work and investment to ask a player to start with.

The system is very similar to that of the Pendragon RPG, and in my experience at least it works rather well with new players, mainly because it serves both as an introduction to the setting and as a personalized description of the character's position in it, which helps the character's player to understand his social environment. These background informations can indeed help the player to understand how to create a character that fits well into the setting.

[styopa]

It's almost like the Traveller character generation system, without the chance of dying.

[GamingGlen]

This is not going to be good for new players.  They will be overwhelmed learning the system, and then be even more overwhelmed with an elaborate background system in a world they know nothing about (as already pointed out).

We have a beginner's D&D5e ongoing-campaign game at my store on Sunday.  I see new players being confused with starting a new character, despite the Quick Build paragraph written for each class, and then they are even more confused when told to level up their character to the average group level (level 7 currently).  I foresee the same problems with this current concept for the new version of RQ.  Top it off, they spend maybe half the game session making their character before they even get a chance to play.  I thought about making some templates to speed up character creation for D&D5E, and have done so with MRQ2/RQ6 (mostly pre-assigning skill points based on a theme), but that does take away total control of character creation.

I prefer the zero-to-hero style of play.  IMO, that's where the game should start, and optionally have the elaborate background system so proposed since it's usually easier to add than to subtract.  I do like elaborate background systems, being an avid Traveller player and referee.

 

 

Edited June 13, 2016 by GamingGlen
typo

[MOB]

8 hours ago, pachristian said:

Sorry, this just doesn't sound very new-player-friendly. They need to start in media res - in other words, do stuff first, fill in backstory later.

From my experience playtesting the new rules, the Family Background is doing stuff though - it's engaging and fun, so the players do feel like they are already taking part in the game. Of course, if you want to skip right past the family background section, you can.

[MOB]

4 hours ago, styopa said:

It's almost like the Traveller character generation system, without the chance of dying.

Yes, instead it's poor old grandpa who gets eaten by the Crimson Bat

[Mankcam]

I quite like doing expanded background char gen like this, but I also agree that an alternative quick roll up method should still exist and be presented as an option in CRQ4

I do like the flavour of what I have read so far, just as long as it is a generic process or a cultural table (not different tables for different ethnicities)

Good stuff

 

 

Edited June 13, 2016 by Mankcam

[Jeff]

There is a quick gen provided - I personally do not like it as I find that using the family history results in far more interesting characters. But it is there.

The family background in the core rules is tailored to the six homelands presented in the core rules, but really helps show how interlinked these homelands are. 

[Mankcam]

I like having access to a  quick char gen, but I personally think expanded char gen is a great thing and adds a lot of enjoyment and creativity to the char gen process.

My only concern about it being specifically homeland driven is that it potentially straight jackets players into only creating characters from only those homelands. However I suspect experienced GMs won't find this too much a challenge to design other homeland backgrounds, and hopefully the ones provided can be used as a guide.

Of course I really need to see the CRQ4 book, otherwise I am purely speculating. It all still sounds pretty good to me.

Edited June 13, 2016 by Mankcam

[Byll]

I like the idea of the background system, is there flexibility for background passions be created for using lower stakes events for smaller mods (that avoid character ending up hobnobbing with major figures in heroquests and battles before they enter play)? I guess that a GM can work out something for himself,  but might there be a couple of examples given of characters being created at intermediate ability-ranges between zero and hero? Personally I am much happier nearer the zero end where the world is not being worried about which side of bed a player got out of.

[Yinkin]

I like the sound of this! It is always good to tie the charaters into the world, and I dare say that this will make Glorantha easier to introduce people to. The clan generation in HQ is awesome, but this is much more personal, and I think that makes it a more powerful tool.

And I foresee we'll see both a lot of fan made and official family background material for other ethnicities, and also other times! Personally I really like the pre-sartar era of KoDP, and it would be interesting to see someone tackle making family background tables for those times!

[Jeff]

That is in fact one of the goals - I would love to see plenty of official and fanmade variants of this for different homelands, even different tribes. 

[Prime Evil]

I like the general idea, but the devil is going to be in the execution. I agree that tying the process closely to specific homelands is problematic - it makes it very difficult to use the rules with different eras or different parts of Glorantha (or other settings, for that matter).

[Joerg]

 

8 minutes ago, Prime Evil said:

I like the general idea, but the devil is going to be in the execution. I agree that tying the process closely to specific homelands is problematic - it makes it very difficult to use the rules with different eras or different parts of Glorantha (or other settings, for that matter).

You will need an idea what happened in the last two generations of the region you are playing in. Not a big deal, unless you are playing a long-lived species like Tolkien-pastiche elves, or other immortals like Brithini.

Basically, this is an exercise in world building, or condensing your background history into player-manageable bits.

Years ago, something like this was sold as a stand-alone product - Central Casting, if anyone remembers this.

RPGGeek does:
https://rpggeek.com/rpgseries/2519/central-casting

Brought to you by one of the creators of Griffin Mountain.

Edited June 13, 2016 by Joerg
missing letters

[Mankcam]

Interesting to see Paul Jaquays name on something like this so many years ago, although I shouldn't be surprised

In some ways, similar products to this I expect

http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=55102&filters=0_0_0&manufacturers_id=576

and this

http://www.rpgnow.com/product/108091/Background--Details-Kit?src=also_purchased&filters=0_0_0&manufacturers_id=576

Edited June 13, 2016 by Mankcam

[pachristian]

Sell me on this idea.

Tell me that you've had it play tested by a new GM, who does not know Glorantha, for a new group of players who do not know Glorantha or the D100 system. 

THAT is the acid test. If they found it easy to use, and liked it, then we're good. If they had reservations, then we're bad.