Lokarnos info

[epullen]

Can someone point me to the best source of info on Lokarnos? I'm about to start playing in a RQG Sun County game and am interested in playing an initiate of Lokarnos. 

[Nick Brooke]

There's a RQ3 short-form cult writeup in the Red Box (Gods of Glorantha, 1986), and there'll be a RQG full-length cult writeup in Cults of Glorantha (2022?). Solar pantheon god of wagons and trade. Skills are Drive, Evaluate, Human Lore & Orate; spirit magic is Detect Gold, Detect Silver, Farsee, Glamour, Glue & Repair; Rune spells are Coin Wheel & Hie Wagon (both in the Red Book of Magic); the only listed Associate Cult is Yelm, who provides Salamanders. Priests of Lokarnos aren't supported by the cult, but only have to tithe 30% of time and income.

Lokarnos is interesting because the cult's abilities are more about logistics and coinage than "trade" per se (in which both Issaries and Etyries have a distinct edge), which probably represents the cult's role in transporting to and from the imperial centre and minting currency, rather than entrepreneurial business. Which tells you things it's fun to know about the Dara Happan Empire.

In our take on Glamour, Lokarnos cult rickshaws are the licensed yellow cabs of the imperial capital.

[jajagappa]

5 hours ago, Nick Brooke said:

Lokarnos is interesting because the cult's abilities are more about logistics and coinage than "trade" per se (in which both Issaries and Etyries have a distinct edge), which probably represents the cult's role in transporting to and from the imperial centre and minting currency, rather than entrepreneurial business.

I often think of the Lokarnos wagoneers as the loyal and/or sturdy companions to the Issaries or Etyries merchant.  The ones reminding the merchant they need to get a move on it if they want to reach Boldhome before the weather gets bad, or that they need to stop at the caravanserai for repairs before everything goes bust.

5 hours ago, Nick Brooke said:

In our take on Glamour, Lokarnos cult rickshaws are the licensed yellow cabs of the imperial capital.

And the local "truck" drivers ensuring goods are appropriately delivered from markets to the vendors.

[Eff]

On one level, Lokarnos is emblematic of the tributary temple-state, where much large-scale "trade" was a formalized concentration and redistribution of goods, but on another level, Lokarnos initiates have special hats they wear and a cot concealed in their wagons and share warnings about overly conscientious Issaries/Etyries merchants and their scrupulously accurate sets of weights and measures when they meet up at the caravanserai. They probably all know the phrase "bill of lading" even if they're illiterate and just jab the stylus into the clay to complete it.

They might even know why Lokarnos slowed, and be willing to tell you it's because people kept rushing him. 

[jajagappa]

1 hour ago, Eff said:

They might even know why Lokarnos slowed, and be willing to tell you it's because people kept rushing him.

Unless you're from Imther, and they've shared the story how Lokarnos came to agreement with the Ferryman of the Dead to serve in his stead for a period of time in exchange for passage across the Styx.

[scott-martin]

This is great! I hope you'll keep us in the loop on what you find out in play about your god.

IMG they were once closer to the "true" merchant cults than they are today but as others have mentioned their real cosmic role was elsewhere and has now been forgotten or deliberately obfuscated. A character exploring the mysteries around Sun County might be able to participate in the uh reinvention of the wheel. 

Who is he really? I think the wagon man has always been envious of the riders even when he rose to a celestial estate in some vanished imperial system or another . . . while the riders might have had a word for him that sounded a little like "vendref," crippled (walking) thing. There may be vestiges of shamanic ordeals. (Mules are sterile.) And while he was never quite a charioteer there are family relationships there to explore as well. Who were his bad dogs? Who slipped the pin off his axle as the old empires imploded? Where is it now?

 

[Akhôrahil]

Lokarnos merchants are, as they say, "wheeling and dealing".

[Darius West]

On 1/20/2022 at 10:51 AM, epullen said:

Can someone point me to the best source of info on Lokarnos? I'm about to start playing in a RQG Sun County game and am interested in playing an initiate of Lokarnos. 

Lokarnos merchants can do something that neither Etyries or Issaries really can.  Wagons are the only way of carrying really large cargoes overland, as mules have a much lower limit as to how much they can carry (55% of their weight).  As a rule, most beasts of burden using a wagon can haul x6 their bodyweight with a modern harness, so about x4 with a bronze age rig (in my estimation, based on the archaeologically known tech).  This means that Lokarnos merchants can deal in bulk goods like timber and grain, while still carrying smaller lighter cargoes.  It is generally assumed that as Solar worshippers that they will use horses, but there is no reason for them not to buy and use mules, or even Prax beasts.

[Joerg]

I don't think that Lokarnos would have played any role in Murharhzarm's or Anaxial's Dara Happa.

Murharzarm had gazzam (earth shakers) as domestic beasts and supposedly as beasts of burden. Possibly as draft beasts for river transport.

Anaxial ruled only over cities on the Oslir, with the neighboring regions as more or less reliable allies. His Dara Happa appears to have been a rice-growing agriculture, with little demand for overland transport either.

 

According to Pamaltelan sky lore, the planetary deity Lokarnos is one of the three Sky Witches, brn from Dendara's dip into the Underworld, and rising into the sky alongside the Blue Moon (which accompanied the Sky River). Lokarnos was the time-keeper, one of the first planets to follow the Sunpath on a regular schedule. None of the other planets (former planetary sons) did anything like that. It took the Bridling of Kargzant in 109 or 111 to tie Lightfore to that regular pattern.

 

Wagons only make sense where river barges cannot reach, and they require either passably good roads or flat territory like grasslands - conditions found among the dry farmers of Peloria, mostly west of the Oslir River. Bringing their grain to the temple granaries would have required wagons. It is possible that the cult only really took to that roll under the Jenaron dynasty

[Ladygolem]

49 minutes ago, Joerg said:

Murharzarm had gazzam (earth shakers) as domestic beasts and supposedly as beasts of burden. Possibly as draft beasts for river transport.

No reason they couldn't hitch wagons to dinosaurs, however...

[Jeff]

On 1/19/2022 at 4:51 PM, epullen said:

Can someone point me to the best source of info on Lokarnos? I'm about to start playing in a RQG Sun County game and am interested in playing an initiate of Lokarnos. 

OK, there's maybe 100 or so wagoneers in Sun County. They mainly carry grain upriver to New Pavis - initially to feed the Lunar garrison, now to feed Argrath's army. They likely came with the Lunar conquest in 1610 and have become a feature in Sun County. 

[Jape_Vicho]

43 minutes ago, Jeff said:

OK, there's maybe 100 or so wagoneers in Sun County. They mainly carry grain upriver to New Pavis - initially to feed the Lunar garrison, now to feed Argrath's army. They likely came with the Lunar conquest in 1610 and have become a feature in Sun County. 

Oh so the restriction on trading only through the Lokarnos cult and the usage of Wheels as only coin are recent additions in Mo Baustra? I thought those were standard practices thoughout all Sun Counties. In that case, is the cult of Issaries still practiced in Sun County Prax (or was it before those changes were introduced)?

[Zodgrod]

Ressurecting (one-use, I assure you) this thread as I have exactly the same question as Jape and have a Sun County player who wants to be a trader.  Any thoughts on how people play/GM really any of the minor cults in any Sun Dome communities welcome!

[jajagappa]

22 minutes ago, Zodgrod said:

Ressurecting (one-use, I assure you) this thread as I have exactly the same question as Jape and have a Sun County player who wants to be a trader.  Any thoughts on how people play/GM really any of the minor cults in any Sun Dome communities welcome!

While my game is based in Imther, not Sun County, I have a player who's character is the local variant of Lokarnos (the other characters are an Etyries merchant and an Irrippi Ontor scribe). The character is in charge of the wagons, organizing the caravan, and assisting in the trade business (a joint venture with the Etyries merchant as the characters are brother and sister). Some of the campaign time goes into identifying where they are traveling to, what trade opportunities are likely to exist, and gathering rumors and information about the route, dangers, etc. 

Focal areas for the Lokarnos cult are on moving goods around via caravans, particularly wagons. They are commoners, not nobles - the ones who actually get the work done or know the people who can get stuff done.

The cult teaches skills of Bargain and Evaluate, as well as Insight (human) and Speak (Tradetalk), so they should be good at digging up useful rumors and information. They've also got useful magic for detecting coins (silver, gold), scanning (Farsee), moving faster, and repairing stuff.

[Minlister]

Personally, I take the god of wheels in a wider sense and give to Lokarnos and its cult all kind of wheel mechanisms, like the water/wind mills: through the wheel, Lokarnos harness the power of the other gods to the benefit of Yelm! All hail Lokarnos! 

Maybe the God Learners highkacked this cult's secrets to build Zistor?  

 

[radmonger]

I  see Lokarnos as more of a trucker than a trader. They carry big loads of stuff from here to there, in accordance with a deal or plan someone else has arranged.

They are always dealing with people outside their community, so they still need tradetalk to talk to people along the route, and bargain to haggle over the price of fodder and tolls. Some do use those skills and contacts to do a little dealing on the side, setting aside a small space in the wagon for goods they buy and sell with their own money.  This is always officially discouraged, and sometimes harshly punished.

As a result, many will make a show of refusing payment in common coinage for their services. Instead, golden wheels are gifted between the nobles or temples who wanted the goods delivered in the first place. As such wheels are sacred to Lokarnos, a divination will confirm the transfer took place, even if it was hundreds of miles away.

This has yet to develop into a full-scale distributed banking system, but the coffee-shops of Raibanth are abuzz with the possibilities...

 

[jajagappa]

20 minutes ago, radmonger said:

I  see Lokarnos as more of a trucker than a trader. They carry big loads of stuff from here to there, in accordance with a deal or plan someone else has arranged.

Yes, this is largely how I see them functioning. But they'll definitely know all the caravaserai's ("truck stops") along the way - which are good, which are bad, etc.

[mfbrandi]

47 minutes ago, radmonger said:

a divination will confirm the transfer took place, even if it was hundreds of miles away. This has yet to develop into a full-scale distributed banking system

I had someone else — likely hiding behind a mask or shell company — down as the deity of fintech, cryptocurrency, internet banking, and suchlike shenanigans. All trades are verified via straightforward human sacrifice. Simpler mathematics than the blockchain and — She assures me — more sustainable from an ecological perspective.

Spoiler

I say ‘shell company’, but She says ‘sloughed exoskeleton cult.’ All hail Our Lady of the Waiting Mouth!

[Jeff]

Reason for Continued Existence

Lokarnos is the god of the wheel, a magical token he created to honor Yelm. Through cleverness, he made carts and wagons and loaded them with goods to help his betters. He is worshiped by teamsters, bullwhackers, carters, sutlers, and others who drive wheeled vehicles pulled by oxen, horses, or other draft animals.

Despite being a solar cult, Lokarnos is welcomed in civilized Orlanthi lands and in the lands of the Earth goddesses. 

Social/Political Position and Power

Lokarnos is a god of common workers, and his cult does not rule or command, nor does it have a great cosmic role to play. However, in some areas, his cult members effectively control the transport of goods, and thus, the cult’s importance often exceeds its official sway. Where it can, the cult asserts authority over wagons and carts, requiring that drivers be at least lay members of Lokarnos. The cult makes no such claim over chariots.

The Lunar army relies on the wagons of the Lokarnos cult to move its baggage train. The quartermasters of the army are members of the cult. 

Particular Likes and Dislikes

The cult is very friendly with Issaries and other mercantile orders such as Etyries. When an Issaries merchant wishes to haul goods in a cart or wagon, he will seek out a Lokarnos wagoner. Similarly, when a Lokarnos wagoner wants to sell goods, he will seek out an Issaries merchant. This friendship does not extend to Darkness cults; the Lokarnos wagoners are unfriendly to Argan Argar and other Darkness deities.

[Jeff]

58 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

Yes, this is largely how I see them functioning. But they'll definitely know all the caravaserai's ("truck stops") along the way - which are good, which are bad, etc.

Lokarnos' cult are the Teamsters of Genertela. Not merchants, not traders, not administrators. 

[Squaredeal Sten]

3 hours ago, Minlister said:

Personally, I take the god of wheels in a wider sense and give to Lokarnos and its cult all kind of wheel mechanisms, like the water/wind mills: through the wheel, Lokarnos harness the power of the other gods to the benefit of Yelm! All hail Lokarnos! 

Maybe the God Learners highkacked this cult's secrets to build Zistor?  

 

Wind and water mills look to me like Mostali  work.  They involve more complex assemblies than the simple wheel.  

[Zodgrod]

Wow, fascinating.  So the markets of Mo Baustra are likely administered by Issaries or Eteryies cultists (or a mix therein)....and both likely to cooperate heavily with Lokarnosites.  

Thanks!

[jajagappa]

34 minutes ago, Zodgrod said:

So the markets of Mo Baustra are likely administered by Issaries or Eteryies cultists (or a mix therein)....and both likely to cooperate heavily with Lokarnosites.

Yes. Issaries is the god of the markets - only he can create a Neutral Ground. Etyries will administer such where the Lunars rule - her markets definitely favor the Lunar Empire (the Red Emperor gets his cut).

[g33k]

3 hours ago, Jeff said:

... The Lunar army relies on the wagons of the Lokarnos cult to move its baggage train. The quartermasters of the army are members of the cult.  ...

3 hours ago, Jeff said:

Lokarnos' cult are the Teamsters of Genertela. Not merchants, not traders, not administrators. 

And yet, the "quartermaster" is usually an expert in matters of logistics ... and thus (I presume) a very-able administrator.
Not the "teamsters" (lay members & some Initiates) but their leadership (the more-capable Initiates, most priests).

Have I misunderstood something?

[Jeff]

30 minutes ago, g33k said:

And yet, the "quartermaster" is usually an expert in matters of logistics ... and thus (I presume) a very-able administrator.
Not the "teamsters" (lay members & some Initiates) but their leadership (the more-capable Initiates, most priests).

Have I misunderstood something?

By administrator I mean someone who administers territory or a city - part of the Lunar ruling elite.