Bandits in Sartar - what cults could they be initiates of?

[Scornado]

Trying to produce a pack of bandits operating in south-west Sartar ad wondering what cults they might be members of.  I assume banditry is dishonourable so Humakt is out.  Orlanth Adventurous seems possible though there's some question of honour there.  I know RQG has the bandit profession and suggests the Gors, Eurmal, Black Fang etc.  Only the last seems truly nasty.  The rest, except perhaps Eurmal, seem to require a certain deviation from what is expected of an initiate to become a proper bandit.

What about the more despicable types - the looters and murderers?

Edited November 2, 2023 by Scornado

[Richard S.]

Orlanth is definitely a bandit god. He may prefer you fight honorably but he's not completely bound by it like Humakt. Plenty of Sartarites turned bandit during the occupation, and the Old Tarshites have been doing it for even longer. You might even consider regular inter-clan raiding a form of banditry. For other gods, pretty much any air god fits the bill, all of them being big fans of violence and taking what you want by force. Gagarth is probably the most quintessential bandit god, being a god of full-time outlaws and murderers who can't exist in regular society. Of course, that also makes him the least common bandit god, since his initiates can't just go back to the farm or the city if things settle down - you don't just leave the wild hunt!

Edited November 2, 2023 by Richard S.

[Godlearner]

16 minutes ago, Scornado said:

I assume banditry is dishonourable so Humakt is out.

I wouldn't be so sure. Robin Hood anyone?

[Scornado]

30 minutes ago, Godlearner said:

I wouldn't be so sure. Robin Hood anyone?

Yes, but in this case I want the bad guys, not the alternately good ones.  The ones who rob from the rich and the poor, and probably stab them too.

[metcalph]

Good:  Orlanth

Bad:  Argan Argar, Waha, 

Ugly: Gagarth, Maran Gor

[Richard S.]

23 minutes ago, metcalph said:

Bad:  Argan Argar

I don't think AA would be too big on banditry, he's a god of harmony. If he's any sort of criminal, it's a mafia boss.

[AndrewTBP]

After the Dragonrise? Lunar initiates driven into the wilderness between the clans. Like in the Starter Set adventure. 

[Akhôrahil]

Bandits are just guys, and in some areas, the difference between a large bandit gang and a small clan might be fluid.

Orlanth isn't opposed to banditry and raiding within some pretty loose limits, so I would expect the large majority to be Orlanth-worshipers. Gagarth for the absolute scum, though.

[svensson]

There are several deities that a bandit might worship

- Orlanth

- Eurmal

- Gargarth

- Ygg [for pirates]

- Lanbril

But you should also remember that one guy's 'bandit' is another guy's 'freedom fighter' or 'Robin Hood' or 'committer of survival crimes'. Point of view is important to that definition.

[Joerg]

Up to the Dragonrise, bandits in Sartar could claim to be freedom fighters holding out against the Lunars while taking from herders, merchants etc. what they need to survive.

Kallyr becoming prince changest this equation. All of a sudden, the kingdom's peace is no longer the occupation forces' oppressive peace but an obligation to the people.

There are bandits who turn into regular fighting forces, enjoying support by the prince. Probably a majority, as they can now have housing and family again, but not all bandits are going to flock to her banner.

Bandit and rebel groups will have long-standing feuds with one another, and if one group joins Kallyr's cause, their rivals are a lot less likely. They might still apply to join a tribal king, but the tribal kings will have been on the receiving end of the bandit activity, and will have to forgive quite a bit damage.

Then there will be new exiles - Lunar-friendly people now forced into the wilds, keeping an eye on their kin rather than fleeing to Lunar Tarsh. Some may act as spies for Lunar interest groups - the Eel-ariash, Fazzur, Phargentes, or what remains of Tatius' network of informants.

And there will be Praxian outlaws hiding out in the wetlands for a while. Nowadays possibly including refugees of the Lunar phratries of the Sable People hoping to find a way to join their kin on Hungry Plateau.

[Nick Brooke]

There's a whole Jonstown Compendium campaign with this premise: it's called The Company of the Dragon.

[Nick Brooke]

9 hours ago, Scornado said:

Yes, but in this case I want the bad guys, not the alternately good ones.  The ones who rob from the rich and the poor, and probably stab them too.

Gagarth.

[Scornado]

36 minutes ago, Nick Brooke said:

Gagarth.

Thank you - I was not aware of that one.  Very helpful

[French Desperate WindChild]

Except chalana arroy and humakt i would  say any his is available (and you even may find one of them in the group maybe disapproving their acts but for any reasons staying with them)

 

depending on their gods(desses ) and their potential loyalties / passions the bandits will decide to attack or not an opportunity

ban’s followers may decide to attack any men but not touch women for example

Gargarthi will attack anyone (I think)

Orlanthi may not attack their kin etc..

and a mixed group will be interesting :

one bab’s among Valindi will protect the women even if she will kill their husbands/brothers if death is the choice.

the humakti will refuse to ambush but once their Orlanthi friends have started the fight they may propose a honorable duel to avoid too much violence.

when the white lady will heal anyone once 

 

[David Scott]

15 hours ago, Scornado said:

the looters and murderers?

Gagarth, Valind, Zorak Zoran

[Darius West]

I can see a Humakti being able to act as a bandit.  The crucial thing is not to be dishonorable.  They will likely not rob the poor unless they are poorer than the poor person they accost.  They will be threatening, but polite.  They may not even take all the possessions of the traveler.  They will not lie or ambush them.  They may decide to ransom the traveler.  They are unlikely to hold up members of their own clan, unless they have been exiled and are no longer part of it.

Orlanth Adventurous can make good thieves, and could turn to banditry, but are bound by a measure of honor like Humakti.

I note that Zorak Zoran hasn't been mentioned much, and neither has Stormbull as potential bandits.  They are bruisers and bullies who are very intimidating.  Stormbulls can always "legitimize" their banditry by claiming that they "smelled chaos" on the victim.  Who is going to waste a divination to prove them wrong?

Black Fang only operate around Pavis.  When acting as bandits, they are prone to murder those they accost.

Lanbril isn't about banditry, but about robbery via break-ins and stealth. 

Potentially anyone who has not disavowed violence can become a bandit in hard times. 

Gagarth is the quintessential bandit god.  Contemptible scum who are the opposite of honorable.

Waha isn't a bandit god, but is prepared to turn a blind eye for cases of expediency and advantage.  The worst followers of Waha to be bandits will be morokanths, who are also likely to be slavers.

Tricksters are wastrels and good-for-nothings who have all the makings of great bandits, but they F up at banditry like they do at everything else.  They just can't hold down meaningful employment, even as criminals. Why, there was one trickster I met...

It is possible for chaos cults to take payment rather than attacking.  That is a form of banditry.

It would be interesting to see Yelmalios with kuschile archery and horse skills acting as bandits.  Obviously phalanx tactics won't lend themselves to banditry.

There is no reason why members of the Seven Mothers can't be bandits.  Jakaleel the Witch would be a good bandit.  Danfive Xaron would not, as they have quit their life of crime.

Valind cultists would be nearly as nasty to meet as bandits as Gagarthi.

Troll cults could be nasty bandits, with the most terrifying being Gorakiki worshippers and their big poisonous bugs.

 

[Akhôrahil]

7 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

Except chalana arroy and humakt i would  say any his is available (and you even may find one of them in the group maybe disapproving their acts but for any reasons staying with them)

It's pretty questionable with Issaries as well as equal exchange is his deal. Might not be enough to call down spirits of reprisal, though.

[French Desperate WindChild]

1 hour ago, Akhôrahil said:

It's pretty questionable with Issaries as well as equal exchange is his deal. Might not be enough to call down spirits of reprisal, though.

well yes the issaries looter  will always "lose" if there is a deal the victims will save their lives when the looters will only gain some goods.

However I would say that solving a situation without wounds is accepted by Issaries

I would say that these guys (Humakt, Chalana, Issaries, etc...) are not following any holy path but may be not rejected by their gods (even if the established cults may reject them)

 

(well if we suppose that live is always greater than goods, but unfortunately the current events tend to prove the opposite.)

 

[Jeff]

Most banditry in Sartar is socially sanctioned. Robbery, cattle theft, extortion, etc. Most "bandits" are going to be Orlanth Adventurous bands. After Kallyr is proclaimed Prince, they need to be careful about robbing folk on the royal roads, but there are going to be bands that ignore that proscription or are even tolerated by the new Prince. There are also a few Lanbril rings in Sartar - for example the High Roaders are footboards that operate on the Royal Roads. 

There are those who operate outside of clan and temple, or are actually Praxians operating inside of Sartar. That's going to be Storm Bull, Waha, and Gagarth. Of those Gagarth is the worst.

Finally there are those non-human bandits - dark trolls and trollkin, bachelor centaurs, spiritually maladjusted dragonewts, etc.

Some of the more organized bandit gangs are: 

·       The Red Knives: These bandits are believed to be based in Tarsh, but they range from Western Sartar to the Grazelands.

·       The Moon-Busters: These bandits operate throughout the Far Place and attack Lunar caravans and supply trains. They are believed to be from Giant’s Walk. 

·       Nightwood Trolls: This gang of dark trolls and trollkin are from the Troll Woods. They plague South Sartar and Sun Dome County.

·       Dragonbeak Gang: This gang of dragonewt brigands can be found anywhere in Dragon Pass. They have crested dragonewts as scouts, and demi-bird riding beaked dragonewts provide the heavy muscle. Their base is unknown.

·       The Wild Ones: This gang can be found throughout East Sartar and the verge with Prax. They are believed to be a Pol-Joni group and are as notorious as rustlers as they are as highwaymen.

[Zit]

almost any chaotic cultist can be see as a bandit.

[Shiningbrow]

My 2 bolgs worth...

Firstly, it will greatly depend on why said bandit has become a bandit! What's their relationship to their clan? (also, what's the purpose of the question? For a PC, or for NPCs you're creating??)

I think you should strongly consider .... none! For a few reasons...

Firstly, while Orlanth has been mentioned numerous times, if the bandit has been thrown out of their community, they may no longer feel that bond that could be felt through the god - effectively, their god has abandoned them!

Secondly, if your bandit has been forced into a life of crime, I don't see the need to change into one of the darker cults. They should just try to stick with whatever cult they had before becoming a bandit. Only those who made the decision to go bad would actively choose a bad god to follow.

Thirdly, access to worship rituals. Unless your bandit crew has a high level initiate or above, then any initiates aren't going to be able to readily partake of worship ceremonies (in order to access or recover Rune Points/Spells).

This leaves the rather obvious situation - they are often spirit cult worshippers, and only get their magic from shamans they can pay. (or not bothering to worship anything at all).

Then consider likely scenarios - they've committed kinstrife... Orlanth and the clan no longer recognise them, so they can't go back home. But, they aren't evil murderers and so don't want to switch over to worshipping some other god. What if they used to be a farmer, and worshipped Barntar? Well, that's pretty pointless now, but again, why change? Maybe they were Ernaldan - again, is there much point in switching gods for an unfortunate circumstance?

 

(yes, I'm looking at this from a more human perspective - not the 'I chose the bandit occupation')

[French Desperate WindChild]

3 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

My 2 bolgs worth...

Firstly, it will greatly depend on why said bandit has become a bandit! What's their relationship to their clan? (also, what's the purpose of the question? For a PC, or for NPCs you're creating??)

I think you should strongly consider .... none! For a few reasons...

Firstly, while Orlanth has been mentioned numerous times, if the bandit has been thrown out of their community, they may no longer feel that bond that could be felt through the god - effectively, their god has abandoned them!

Secondly, if your bandit has been forced into a life of crime, I don't see the need to change into one of the darker cults. They should just try to stick with whatever cult they had before becoming a bandit. Only those who made the decision to go bad would actively choose a bad god to follow.

Thirdly, access to worship rituals. Unless your bandit crew has a high level initiate or above, then any initiates aren't going to be able to readily partake of worship ceremonies (in order to access or recover Rune Points/Spells).

This leaves the rather obvious situation - they are often spirit cult worshippers, and only get their magic from shamans they can pay. (or not bothering to worship anything at all).

Then consider likely scenarios - they've committed kinstrife... Orlanth and the clan no longer recognise them, so they can't go back home. But, they aren't evil murderers and so don't want to switch over to worshipping some other god. What if they used to be a farmer, and worshipped Barntar? Well, that's pretty pointless now, but again, why change? Maybe they were Ernaldan - again, is there much point in switching gods for an unfortunate circumstance?

 

(yes, I'm looking at this from a more human perspective - not the 'I chose the bandit occupation')

But you can commit bad acts in a region and go every season far from that in some friendly lands/ temple 🙂